Play Now Don’t Pay Later

I have been reading “Change.edu: rebooting for the new talent economy” by  Andrew S. Rosen. It is about the craziness of higher education. Students were able to go to four year resorts masquerading as colleges with student loans. They got to live in nice places with great food and wonderful recreational facilities but they couldn’t afford them. They couldn’t opt out of the frills to get just the education so they overpaid. The axis of evil of admissions departments, “will give a loan to anyone” government, and “can’t live in the real world” educators have brought back a form of slavery know as “indentured servitude”.  Sad.

Of course, the Democratic candidates have as their motto “When responsibility is needed make the innocent pay.” They want the people who didn’t go to college to pay the student loans of those who did. Giving away “free” is what they think is “fair”. For it is unfair for “Sally or Johnny” to ever face the cost of their actions. Maybe they can call the program “Planned Payback” or they can say they are “Pro-choice” which means not paying.

In all honesty how can these college professors not know about the scam they have benefited from? As far as I know very few have stood against the “future salary loans” of their students.  In my opinion they should be held accountable. They were tenured and could have spoken out but didn’t.

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22 thoughts on “Play Now Don’t Pay Later”

  1. If any business did what higher education did, the progressives would be out their demonstrating against them. It reminds me of crazy multi-level marketing which loads poor people up with products that they are assured will make them rich.

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  2. A quote from the book which I think explains things well.

    You can’t just buy the education. If you want in, you have to buy the gardens, the café, and the football team as well.

     

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  3. 10 Cents:
    They want the people who didn’t go to college to pay the student loans of those who did.

    Not to mention the students who actually did pay for their education sans loans.

    There is no “right” to a college education. More people could pay for themselves if it hadn’t been for govt interference by guaranteeing loans, thus allowing universities to charge exorbitantly higher tuitions.

    Most outrageous example of this form of inflation: USC is the most expensive college in the country (why?) at 75k annually; when my brother attended it was 7k.

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  4. Aren’t colleges the quintessential price gougers? Prices going up 400% is unimaginable in any other industry.

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  5. EThompson:
    Most outrageous example of this form of inflation: USC is the most expensive college in the country (why?) at 75k annually; when my brother attended it was 7k.

    Isn’t USC the college of choice among Saudi princelings?  It may be them bidding up the price.

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  6. John Walker:

    EThompson:
    Most outrageous example of this form of inflation: USC is the most expensive college in the country (why?) at 75k annually; when my brother attended it was 7k.

    Isn’t USC the college of choice among Saudi princelings?  It may be them bidding up the price.

    Is it the Trojan Horse into our country?

    Why would USC be so expensive? Surf board wax?

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  7. John Walker:

    EThompson:
    Most outrageous example of this form of inflation: USC is the most expensive college in the country (why?) at 75k annually; when my brother attended it was 7k.

    Isn’t USC the college of choice among Saudi princelings?  It may be them bidding up the price.

    Hollywood as well. How could we forget Felicity Huffman and Lori Loughlin?

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  8. Make student loans dischargeable through bankruptcy. (Every other loan is, and bankruptcy is not something you want if you can avoid it. It makes life hard.) Allow creditors to collect half of any student loan lost through bankruptcy default from the college the loan was used for. That will mean colleges have skin in the game and less likely to press questionable students to take out loans.

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  9. Seawriter:
    Make student loans dischargeable through bankruptcy. (Every other loan is, and bankruptcy is not something you want if you can avoid it. It makes life hard.) Allow creditors to collect half of any student loan lost through bankruptcy default from the college the loan was used for. That will mean colleges have skin in the game and less likely to press questionable students to take out loans.

    I think a lot of these schools should go bankrupt. They took advantage of these students and the government. They knew that some degrees could at most qualify you for being a waitress or a barista.  These people make used car salesmen look like saints.

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  10. In Bryan Caplan’s book, The Case Against Education, he asks the question, “Would you rather have a Princeton education without the degree, or a Princeton degree without the education?”

    If it takes more than a millisecond to answer this question “the education without the degree”, you’ve twigged to the scam at the heart of “higher education”.  They are not selling an education, but rather a credential, and in many cases the “education” they are selling is irrelevant to the work a person will do after graduation.  All the credential tells the employer is that the person holding it meets some standard of intelligence (which they aren’t allowed to test directly any more) and is willing to do tedious and often pointless work for deferred rewards.

    Thus, the way to attack the higher education racket is by developing independent, trusted, and inexpensive credentialing  institutions which don’t care how you learned what you know but rather whether you know your stuff.  Such things exist in technical fields: certification as a Microsoft Certified Solutions Expert (formerly Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer) opens the door to employment in shops using their garbage regardless of how you learned it.  You can get a General Radiotelephone Operator License (formerly First Class Radiotelephone License) just by showing up and passing the test.  You don’t have to spend a minute in a classroom; I have one, and I didn’t.  This needs to be extended to all fields and all degrees.  Then you go after the scam “universities” by challenging their graduates to pass the certification test in the fields they’ve “studied”, and encourage employers to require certification instead of or in addition to a diploma.

    As I’ve said before, if I were thirty years younger and looking to make a lot of money while doing good at the same time, this is what I would be doing.

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  11. 10 Cents:
    A quote from the book which I think explains things well.

    You can’t just buy the education. If you want in, you have to buy the gardens, the café, and the football team as well.

     

    10 Cents:

    Seawriter:
    Make student loans dischargeable through bankruptcy. (Every other loan is, and bankruptcy is not something you want if you can avoid it. It makes life hard.) Allow creditors to collect half of any student loan lost through bankruptcy default from the college the loan was used for. That will mean colleges have skin in the game and less likely to press questionable students to take out loans.

    I think a lot of these schools should go bankrupt. They took advantage of these students and the government. They knew that some degrees could at most qualify you for being a waitress or a barista.  These people make used car salesmen look like saints.

    Yes, don’t put this financial piece on the professors. Blame them for the poor education part but blame the administrators for the financial part. Make the universities bare the costs of this farce not the students who were defrauded. We must keep working on the education part.

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  12. Bob Thompson:

    10 Cents:
    A quote from the book which I think explains things well.

    You can’t just buy the education. If you want in, you have to buy the gardens, the café, and the football team as well.

     

    10 Cents:

    Seawriter:
    Make student loans dischargeable through bankruptcy. (Every other loan is, and bankruptcy is not something you want if you can avoid it. It makes life hard.) Allow creditors to collect half of any student loan lost through bankruptcy default from the college the loan was used for. That will mean colleges have skin in the game and less likely to press questionable students to take out loans.

    I think a lot of these schools should go bankrupt. They took advantage of these students and the government. They knew that some degrees could at most qualify you for being a waitress or a barista.  These people make used car salesmen look like saints.

    Yes, don’t put this financial piece on the professors. Blame them for the poor education part but blame the administrators for the financial part. Make the universities bare the costs of this farce not the students who were defrauded. We must keep working on the education part.

    With a grin, are you saying the professors knew nothing so can’t be blamed? Sorry, these professors are so quick to put the blame on others but want to act like it is not their fault when things happen in front of them. They are given a place of respect in society and that comes with responsibility.  I am just proposing that “they eat what they dish out”.

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  13. 10 Cents:

    Bob Thompson:

    10 Cents:
    A quote from the book which I think explains things well.

    You can’t just buy the education. If you want in, you have to buy the gardens, the café, and the football team as well.

     

    10 Cents:

    Seawriter:
    Make student loans dischargeable through bankruptcy. (Every other loan is, and bankruptcy is not something you want if you can avoid it. It makes life hard.) Allow creditors to collect half of any student loan lost through bankruptcy default from the college the loan was used for. That will mean colleges have skin in the game and less likely to press questionable students to take out loans.

    I think a lot of these schools should go bankrupt. They took advantage of these students and the government. They knew that some degrees could at most qualify you for being a waitress or a barista.  These people make used car salesmen look like saints.

    Yes, don’t put this financial piece on the professors. Blame them for the poor education part but blame the administrators for the financial part. Make the universities bare the costs of this farce not the students who were defrauded. We must keep working on the education part.

    With a grin, are you saying the professors knew nothing so can’t be blamed? Sorry, these professors are so quick to put the blame on others but want to act like it is not their fault when things happen in front of them. They are given a place of respect in society and that comes with responsibility.  I am just proposing that “they eat what they dish out”.

    Well, I don’t operate within a university environment, but where is the power. Has the political viewpoint distribution of faculty changed over the course of this massive increase in the costs of a college education?

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  14. Bob Thompson:

    10 Cents:

    Bob Thompson:

    10 Cents:
    A quote from the book which I think explains things well.

    You can’t just buy the education. If you want in, you have to buy the gardens, the café, and the football team as well.

     

    10 Cents:

    Seawriter:
    Make student loans dischargeable through bankruptcy. (Every other loan is, and bankruptcy is not something you want if you can avoid it. It makes life hard.) Allow creditors to collect half of any student loan lost through bankruptcy default from the college the loan was used for. That will mean colleges have skin in the game and less likely to press questionable students to take out loans.

    I think a lot of these schools should go bankrupt. They took advantage of these students and the government. They knew that some degrees could at most qualify you for being a waitress or a barista.  These people make used car salesmen look like saints.

    Yes, don’t put this financial piece on the professors. Blame them for the poor education part but blame the administrators for the financial part. Make the universities bare the costs of this farce not the students who were defrauded. We must keep working on the education part.

    With a grin, are you saying the professors knew nothing so can’t be blamed? Sorry, these professors are so quick to put the blame on others but want to act like it is not their fault when things happen in front of them. They are given a place of respect in society and that comes with responsibility.  I am just proposing that “they eat what they dish out”.

    Well, I don’t operate within a university environment, but where is the power. Has the political viewpoint distribution of faculty changed over the course of this massive increase in the costs of a college education?

    “They were just following orders.” I agree the professors were not making the financial decisions but I doubt they were totally oblivious to what was happening. Do they bear no responsibility?

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  15. 10 Cents:

    Bob Thompson:

    10 Cents:

    Bob Thompson:

    10 Cents:
    A quote from the book which I think explains things well.

    You can’t just buy the education. If you want in, you have to buy the gardens, the café, and the football team as well.

     

    10 Cents:

    Seawriter:
    Make student loans dischargeable through bankruptcy. (Every other loan is, and bankruptcy is not something you want if you can avoid it. It makes life hard.) Allow creditors to collect half of any student loan lost through bankruptcy default from the college the loan was used for. That will mean colleges have skin in the game and less likely to press questionable students to take out loans.

    I think a lot of these schools should go bankrupt. They took advantage of these students and the government. They knew that some degrees could at most qualify you for being a waitress or a barista.  These people make used car salesmen look like saints.

    Yes, don’t put this financial piece on the professors. Blame them for the poor education part but blame the administrators for the financial part. Make the universities bare the costs of this farce not the students who were defrauded. We must keep working on the education part.

    With a grin, are you saying the professors knew nothing so can’t be blamed? Sorry, these professors are so quick to put the blame on others but want to act like it is not their fault when things happen in front of them. They are given a place of respect in society and that comes with responsibility.  I am just proposing that “they eat what they dish out”.

    Well, I don’t operate within a university environment, but where is the power. Has the political viewpoint distribution of faculty changed over the course of this massive increase in the costs of a college education?

    “They were just following orders.” I agree the professors were not making the financial decisions but I doubt they were totally oblivious to what was happening. Do they bear no responsibility?

    If the universities could be held financially accountable for their behavior that has led to this point, the faculty would bear a fair share of that accountability burden.

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  16. 10 Cents:
    “They were just following orders.” I agree the professors were not making the financial decisions but I doubt they were totally oblivious to what was happening. Do they bear no responsibility?

    I wouldn’t say none, but relatively little.  Spending on faculty has been more or less flat, while spending on administrators and facilities has exploded.  Some of this has been due to federal mandates, but a lot is simply due to Parkinson’s law: administrators hire more administrators, because as they build their empire they become more important and are better compensated.  And with student loans funding the whole racket, there is no price pressure to restrain the growth.  If you asked the faculty senate, they’d doubtless prefer fewer administrators and more faculty (the real thing, not slave-labour “adjuncts”, many of whom can barely speak English), but they have no button to push to move in that direction.

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  17. Bob Thompson:
    If the universities could be held financially accountable for their behavior that has led to this point, the faculty would bear a fair share of that accountability burden.

    Tenure makes this nearly impossible; not unlike the Supremes who can mangle the Constitution with no repercussions.

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  18. John Walker:
    They are not selling an education, but rather a credential, and in many cases the “education” they are selling is irrelevant to the work a person will do after graduation.

    Of course (!) or as I would put it more bluntly, a college degree is a resume. I was an English/French major from a fairly prestigious university and received many corporate job offers.

    Ironically, all my annual reviews in the real world highlighted my financial and mathematical acumen! A summa English major focusing on the works of James Joyce indicates some analytical skills that are easily transferable to almost any aspect of business.

    Long live the Lib Arts major!

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  19. Don’t major in Aggrieved Group Studies. Major in Econ: at least then you’ll know why you can’t get a job.

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  20. Percival:
    Don’t major in Aggrieved Group Studies. Major in Econ: at least then you’ll know why you can’t get a job.

    I minored in Econ but those graphs I was forced to study turned out to be somewhat irrelevant! This is one of the reasons MBA schools prefer to accept students with 2-3 yrs of workplace experience.

    My corporate boss offered to send me to NYU Stern when I was 25 yrs old but I turned it down. I was learning too much and having a ball working in the real world.

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  21. Bob Thompson:
    Has the political viewpoint distribution of faculty changed over the course of this massive increase in the costs of a college education?

    Yes.   The average faculty has shifted to the Left.   Less so in hard science, engineering, business and agriculture.   More so in social sciences and humanities.

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  22. MJBubba:

    Bob Thompson:
    Has the political viewpoint distribution of faculty changed over the course of this massive increase in the costs of a college education?

    Yes.   The average faculty has shifted to the Left.   Less so in hard science, engineering, business and agriculture.   More so in social sciences and humanities.

    This information is really dated, now, since it was done in 2012.   But the trend was a rapid lurch to the Left.

    https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2012/10/24/survey-finds-professors-already-liberal-have-moved-further-left

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